Carb to EFI conversion...

[mrvette]

Originally Posted by JeffP1167

How does the system compare in numbers to a efi port injected manifold with an elbow and throttle body based on the same engine? Or a efi port injected manifold with say a 4 barrel throttle body?

It is hard to say, as 15 years ago I paid like 300-350 for my stock TPI at Carlisle....with injectors....complete except for them metric bolts...harder to find then....another 30 bux I think, not all THAT bad...

so junkyard computer for ten bux, wiring was basically free/connectors from junkyard...then the Cal Pak...

I know I paid 150 for my LT1 induction off the net with rails...no injectors...

that's what's on the car now with your injectors...runs great...

but of course to fit the L98, I could not have done it without my welder buddy and his TIG machine...

he must have 2 hours of stick time on that conversion....and I have over 6 trips to his place

and the reason it's not pretty and all is I did what I thought was a 'test fit'...

it works perfect, leave well enough ALONE....



so for me to say what stuff costs in today's market is a bit much...

I hear TPI units are still 300 bux complete....no computer....

I had to do a lot of work for my initial conversion...cost me about 750 bux total....this was after the Pontiac conversion, and the boat conversion...so it was easy, really...but that was 15 years ago too...

so today for a bolt on?? USA made....your price is cheep as hell....

but the only foreseeable project it could go on would be the motor home project....

and that's going to be a while...

[Jsup]

Originally Posted by JeffP1167

How does the system compare in numbers to a efi port injected manifold with an elbow and throttle body based on the same engine? Or a efi port injected manifold with say a 4 barrel throttle body?

Ya know, I have always been skeptical about "this part makes more power than that part".

It depends is the answer, on a lot of things.

The 750 CFM will suppport up to 550HP or so, the billet 2000 CFM model will support into 4 digits of HP, and both have been made with this system. It really depends on how you design the motor rather than the parts you use. I have seen people on another "corvette forum" use the top of the line most shiny parts and make basically pathetic HP for the money. I've seen well designed junkyard engines SMOKE those "cool parts" motors.

So I guess philosophically, I don't take a position of "how much power will this part make". The answer is 550 can be supported with the cast version here that I put in this kit, $250 more if you want to go to 1000 for the TB, and incrementally for bigger injectors if necessary. At that point, you'd want a new ECU and I'll let that go for $1900 complete with wideband. See how fast it goes up? That is if the rest of the build is up to the task.

If you have $3000-4000 to drop for an intake, we can set you up with one of these, or make something completely unique based on your wallet:

[Only registered and activated users can see links. Click Here To Register...]

The niche for this is budget minded people who want to do a carb conversion, or get off the cross fire. If you want a complete system with an ECU and multiple injectors and such, that can run $4000. If budget isn't an issue, there are other options. I sell more 160 and 220 injectors than anything else. Many of my customers are using 2 or 3 220s per cyl making 2000-3000 HP.

For the street, we just finished up a 750 HP GTO and 1100 C5. That cost money.

See customers using our ECUs and injectors:

Mark Pickens:


Corey Glidwell


TJ Tracey



Brad Clarke



The throttle body conversion is a street solution.

I'm testing how well this stuff performs in a street car.

[brngrhd]

Why not one of these?



EZ-EFI® Self Tuning Fuel Injection System (Base Kit)

EZ-EFI® Self Tuning Fuel Injection System (Base Kit) Quantity in Basket: None
Code: 30226-KIT
Price: $1,837.45
Shipping Weight: 11.20 pounds

Quantity:


FAST® engineers set out to develop the ultimate fueling strategy for the EZEFI ®. The EZ-EFI® features patent pending technology with the most advanced self tuning control strategy available anywhere today. Simply hook up the four necessary wires and any optional wires, answer the basic setup Wizard questions on the included hand-held display and the system tunes itself as you drive. Countless research and development hours were spent on a number of prototype test vehicles to develop a high-quality system truly worthy of the FAST® brand.

Capable of supporting up to 550 horsepower engines, the FAST® EZ-EFI® Self Tuning Fuel Injection System can be purchased as a complete system, including the ECU, wide-band oxygen sensor, wiring harness, fuel injectors, optional fuel pump kit and other assorted components, including the innovative 4150 Throttle Body from FAST®.

The FAST® 4150 Throttle Body delivers the total package approach for anyone with an existing 4150-type intake manifold. Everything comes with the kit, including appropriate fuel injectors and fuel rails. In addition, it works with the original carb-style throttle linkage & is ready to accept all OEM sensors.




After this weekend if mine does not sell I'll sell it to you brand new for 1450 plus the ride.

[mrvette]

Originally Posted by JeffP1167

How does the system compare in numbers to a efi port injected manifold with an elbow and throttle body based on the same engine? Or a efi port injected manifold with say a 4 barrel throttle body?

I know from reading up on household HVAC manuals that when you turn a 90* corner in a duct, you loose some large percentage of airflow/pressure/delivery....

I can't imagine it being much different from blow to suck....

at any rate, when doing a DPFI on a old Pontiac 455 years ago, that thing has INSTANT throttle response and from near zero rpm too....1000 cfm throttle body in place of the AFB pattern tends to do that...

I used a antiquated junkyard system for it, but it pulled like MAD....

I should have been a diesel mechanic, I guess....instant torque at 200 rpm....

[Jsup]

Originally Posted by brngrhd

Why not one of these?



EZ-EFI® Self Tuning Fuel Injection System (Base Kit)

EZ-EFI® Self Tuning Fuel Injection System (Base Kit) Quantity in Basket: None
Code: 30226-KIT
Price: $1,837.45
Shipping Weight: 11.20 pounds

Quantity:


FAST® engineers set out to develop the ultimate fueling strategy for the EZEFI ®. The EZ-EFI® features patent pending technology with the most advanced self tuning control strategy available anywhere today. Simply hook up the four necessary wires and any optional wires, answer the basic setup Wizard questions on the included hand-held display and the system tunes itself as you drive. Countless research and development hours were spent on a number of prototype test vehicles to develop a high-quality system truly worthy of the FAST® brand.

Capable of supporting up to 550 horsepower engines, the FAST® EZ-EFI® Self Tuning Fuel Injection System can be purchased as a complete system, including the ECU, wide-band oxygen sensor, wiring harness, fuel injectors, optional fuel pump kit and other assorted components, including the innovative 4150 Throttle Body from FAST®.

The FAST® 4150 Throttle Body delivers the total package approach for anyone with an existing 4150-type intake manifold. Everything comes with the kit, including appropriate fuel injectors and fuel rails. In addition, it works with the original carb-style throttle linkage & is ready to accept all OEM sensors.


After this weekend if mine does not sell I'll sell it to you brand new for 1450 plus the ride.

You can't control the timing curve with the FAST. It's $600 more. You can with the 7747. Why wouldn't you want to control timing whey you're trying to control fuel?

If you wanted to spend a couple extra bucks, I'd throw my ECU in there for $2500 for the complete system. HOWEVER with my system you have complete control of the timing curve, and a PC interface rather than a little LCD screen.

So for a few bucks more you're getting a LOT more, and a totally different class of product, as opposed as paying $600 more for a name.

And to be honest, the kit that is MORE comparable to this is $2244. You quoted the base kit price so the comparison isn't fair. What is fair is their complete kit for $2244 to my kit with the full blown ECU (which smokes their handheld thing) at $2500 for the ability to have timing control and PC interface.

And finally, if you really need help, I will support you with the engineers who actually designed and built this. Can't get that anywhere else! . Just talking to me alone is worth a few bucks.

Complete kit from FAST: [Only registered and activated users can see links. Click Here To Register...]

Other than the FAST name, what's the advantage?

[Jsup]

Oh, btw, I carry FAST too. FAST is a good system and has it's place. However, IMO this TB has a different spot in the market. If you're running a setup with coil over plug, use the Fast. If you have a crossfire, or going from Carb to FI and need a budget solution, this TB can work.

If you're running a distributor system, after I'm done testing, I'm confident this new ECU (for me) is going to be the way to go.

I try to understand each niche' in the market and provide the most value to solve the problem. Sometimes it's FAST, sometimes it's something else.

Just sayin. Put the right shoe on the right sized foot for the best budget for a quality part.

[brngrhd]

oops sorry that is what i get for skimming over your post i was reading it as you were looking for an EFI not selling the stuff. sorry for jacking your thread.

[Jsup]

Originally Posted by brngrhd

oops sorry that is what i get for skimming over your post i was reading it as you were looking for an EFI not selling the stuff. sorry for jacking your thread.

Don't sweat it, I appreciate the softball!!!

Gave me the chance to ramble and make a good comparison. No biggie!

If you need injectors or anything for that setup, [Only registered and activated users can see links. Click Here To Register...] (shameless plug)

[clutchdust]

This looks like a system I would like to try. It won't be any time soon as I'm currently broke, and sick. But I really want to ditch the Holley in my car and go for FI. The general question I have is more about TBI vs MPFI and the like. I see systems like yours and the Holley Commander system that are in the $1500 range. Then I see some really trick looking systems like that Edlebrock ProFlo system for about twice as much. I have to imagine that the ProFlo system makes more power, but another $1500 worth? I'm guessing there's maybe 15-20hp difference between the two, max, with no other differences in the engine. I'm thinking I could find that power difference or more somewhere else for less than that. Besides, I'm not looking to make 500+hp. I want to put down somewhere around 300-350hp to the wheels. If I can do that, I'll be plenty happy.