Traction Control

Bullshark

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
Messages
710
Location
St. Charles, Missouri
As a part of the Blue Angel Drive train upgrade, I am considering incorporating Traction Control (TCS). With the 700hp plus BB engine and and the TKO 600 tranny, I might need a little help. The Holley Dominator EFI has the PWM inputs to monitor wheel spin sensors, but that is about the extent of my knowledge. Anyone have any experience setting up a C3 drive train with wheel spin sensor capability?
 
If it is like my 97 camaro it is annoying. But you would need rear sensor like these. as well as front sensors.

20130915_184031_zpseb224b23.jpg

20130915_184014_zpsb23ab777.jpg
 
Rather than monkey around with the gear teeth, why not mount the sensor next to the brake caliper, reading the struts between the halves of the rotor surface???? Hell, for that matter mount it where you want, and extend out the mag field with a piece of steel bent and glued to the sensor, down to where the slots are, extend out the magnet, so to speak....

God, I"m lazy......


:harhar::gurney:
 
As a part of the Blue Angel Drive train upgrade, I am considering incorporating Traction Control (TCS). With the 700hp plus BB engine and and the TKO 600 tranny, I might need a little help. The Holley Dominator EFI has the PWM inputs to monitor wheel spin sensors, but that is about the extent of my knowledge. Anyone have any experience setting up a C3 drive train with wheel spin sensor capability?

Pardon my confusion, but I would expect the wheel speed inputs to be frequency inputs, not PWM inputs. All my experience with wheel speed sensors has been with variable reluctance types, which require some signal conditioning for the CPU to read the sensor signal frequency (and deal with the varying voltage).
About the only thing I can think of on a C3 that would be remotely similar in design for wheel speed sensing would be the brake rotor interior cooling fins. However, that's not very conducive to being able to easily position a sensor. (Edit: Missed Gene's comment about the magnetic field extender. Never tried that, but theory says it should work. Definitely a thinking out of the box idea. Good job Gene.)
The speedo sensor isn't a wheel sensor, although it should give a reading of the average of the two rear wheels.
 
Last edited:
Does the Holley ECU just monitor the wheel spin or does it try to change engine parameters based on, say the difference between the driven and rolling wheels?
 
As a part of the Blue Angel Drive train upgrade, I am considering incorporating Traction Control (TCS). With the 700hp plus BB engine and and the TKO 600 tranny, I might need a little help. The Holley Dominator EFI has the PWM inputs to monitor wheel spin sensors, but that is about the extent of my knowledge. Anyone have any experience setting up a C3 drive train with wheel spin sensor capability?

Pardon my confusion, but I would expect the wheel speed inputs to be frequency inputs, not PWM inputs. All my experience with wheel speed sensors has been with variable reluctance types, which require some signal conditioning for the CPU to read the sensor signal frequency (and deal with the varying voltage).
About the only thing I can think of on a C3 that would be remotely similar in design for wheel speed sensing would be the brake rotor interior cooling fins. However, that's not very conducive to being able to easily position a sensor. (Edit: Missed Gene's comment about the magnetic field extender. Never tried that, but theory says it should work. Definitely a thinking out of the box idea. Good job Gene.)
The speedo sensor isn't a wheel sensor, although it should give a reading of the average of the two rear wheels.

Better thinking, that way the INSIDE of the vents are cleaner, and less trash to be circulated across the sensor....much more stable on the read out too....maybe even better than the factory stock because the trash it not spun onto the magnet.....

Speaking of which, I did a rotor job on some truck not long ago, and the pads and rotors were toast to the point the sensor was just buried in iron filings from the rotors, both sides.....I was amazed they still sensed anything...things looked like a porcupine so they got the air jet treatment....

:gurney:
 
TCS is a PITA anyways. All my LT1's TCS does is kick my foot up off the floor. Sometimes it is just plain annoying especially when there isn't much traction issue.

Newer vettes might be different though, but mine defaults on when you start the car so I also have to disable it with the switch.
 
Pardon my confusion, but I would expect the wheel speed inputs to be frequency inputs, not PWM inputs.

You are right Mike, My BAD, I was thinking I would have to rig up some sort of phase lock loop circuit that would compare wheel frequency pulses and output a PWM signal to the ECU to adjust timing or DBW throttle position.
The Holley Dominator ECU has programmable inductive pick up inputs that can configured to detect frequency signal differences. Need to look into that a little more.

Holley has teamed up with a company called Davis Technology that markets a box that detects rapid drive shaft rpm changes and compares them to a preset threshold or on their more expensive box, a running average threshold based on learning. Davis Technologies

These seem way over priced to me.( $500 to $1000) Seems one could incorporate the capability directly into the ECU, but due to racing rules, Holley elected to keep it separate.

I am guessing one would compare front wheel frequency sensor to the rear wheel sensor to detect traction slip?? What about our posi rear diff, does that present a problem??
 
Does the Holley ECU just monitor the wheel spin or does it try to change engine parameters based on, say the difference between the driven and rolling wheels?

Hi Larry
The Dominator ECU has 47 programmable input and 36 output pins. These inputs can be configured for 12V, Ground, Digital Speed, IPU Speed, 5V, 20V, and Thermistor types. The outputs can be configured as +12V, Ground, or +12V and Ground Pulse Width Modulated (PWM) types. These pins can be configured to do anything from sensing transbrake engagement, to lighting an idiot light, to the creation of an all-out data acquisition system. There are some pins that are already configured as fuel pump triggers, electric fan controls, A/C override and IAC kick.
My thinking was exactly that. If I can change timing, and or Drive by Wire throttle position based on the difference between the driven (i.e. rear wheel(s) and the rolling (front) wheels. then I may be able to do some good. How to sense the C3 wheel rotation adequately is big part of the challenge I'm thinking. Gene may be on to something there though.
 
traction control, comes standard in your right foot :)

I remember watching some of the videos of those old farts taking there new, hot off the showroom Vettes, to the drag strip and promptly putting it in the wall not 50 ft. down the track and thinking how in the hell could their reactions be so slow........ now I are one :surrender:
:ripoff: :devil:
 
Last edited:
Didn't I hear a story about you and Chip almost doing that with the old motor?
 
Couldn't the rear wheel sensors/pulse generators be replaced by a magnet on the drive shaft? Or a pair of magnets to keep things balanced... less wires to run, closer to the ecu, simpler in my mind. Then again my mind is simple.
 
Couldn't the rear wheel sensors/pulse generators be replaced by a magnet on the drive shaft? Or a pair of magnets to keep things balanced... less wires to run, closer to the ecu, simpler in my mind. Then again my mind is simple.

That's exactly what Davis Technologies is doing ($550-$1000). I need to look into what Kevin posted. That sounds like something that could be more affordable and cut out the middle man.
 
Top