installing a big block in an 84 vette

better hurry, wife and family's back sunday

i hit the wreckers this morning hoping to find some parts to make this swap easier. after walking the rows of cars i decided on using parts from a newer fwd malibu, lots of them around and all of the accessories are smaller in size than the rwd cars. the first pic shows the bare front of the engine, some room on either side better pic than above,next the smaller parts in front with the older parts in the background. then you can see the power steering pump in place the alternator is going to sit slightly above and beside the head with room in between them for an idler pulley and the power steering reservoir. on the other side i'm going to try and bolt the ac directly to the head and use the old tensioner in its old location. probably need another idler pulley below the ac as well. the big hold up is the missing aluminum water pump( using old iron one for reference ) and finally the ac side of engine. i still haven't decided exactly how the belt is going to run around the accessories, i have power steering pumps for both directions just in case. i guess the best way is to compare to the 350 set up pics and go from there. only one more day before the family gets back so i'll try to make the most of it.

What Generation is your 454?

1976 all iron engine, except intake and water pump. hit a massive brick wall with the ac install, condenser will take up valuable radiator room and evaporator housing needs massive mods to clear exhaust, still scratching back of head. i'm thinking about leaving it out for now. still waiting for that water pump.

This isn't the article I recall seeing several years back, but in case you haven't seen it...

http://www.corvettefever.com/featuredvehicles/corp_0402_1991_chevrolet_corvette/index.html

ripper said:

1976 all iron engine, except intake and water pump. hit a massive brick wall with the ac install, condenser will take up valuable radiator room and evaporator housing needs massive mods to clear exhaust, still scratching back of head. i'm thinking about leaving it out for now. still waiting for that water pump.

Click to expand...

maybe I can help just a bit

if you can locate one thats been wrected or the components the firewall pieces for the LT5 give a great deal more room for headers, than the stock LT1 or L98 firewall parts. a large COMBO OIL /trans fluid cooler mounted where the spare tire normally is reduces the engines need for a huge radiator



Perma-Cool 13318 $209 (summit)

Hedman Hedders 68090 $181.95 fit on one side without mods and on the other one side need one tube re routed to get them to work
if the header flange is strait and flat and your useing a decent gasket (personally I prefer the copper ones) and youve coated the bolt threads in ANTI-SEIZE like you should have almost any decent 6"-8" box end wrench can be used to snug the bolts up firmly







and YEAH! the windshield wiper motor needs to be relocated swapped for a differant ,smaller one,or removed

just a question, how many guys would swap to a big block engine if detailed instructions and a parts list were available?

how many guys would do it on a basis of YOU HAD TOO SUPPLY all parts on a detailed APPROVED PARTS list before the project was started,and someone ELSE did all the labor for lets say $1500 -$2000 plus your APPROVED parts?
keep in mind this normally takes about 10-12 days to do and de-bug so its dirt cheap labor at that price plus theres alot of tools and skill necessary, to get this done even close to correctly

theres no way a c-4 will exactly match the weight distribution and handling of a C6 BUT the strait line accelleration CAN be equaled or exceeded with a decent well thought thru and executed BBC swap, and at about less than 1/2 the price of a new Zo6, and its no trick to easily exceed the hp of the stock Zo6, depending on the extent of the mods you want, and your fabricating and shopping skills somewhere between 15K and 35K should get you one very fast BBC C4 and that price COULD easily include the car itself, if youve already go the car you can knock a good chunk like 5K-15K of the cost off the total.
PLUS if your like me, having built or modified most of the car yourself, and owning something rather unique, has a strong draw to my pride of ownership vs paying huge bucks for a Z06 that anyone with a fat wallet can own.
plus theres nothing that sounds like the rumble and rolling lope of a high compression, BBC with over 500 cubic inch displacement.
personally opening the hood to display a nice BBC in a c4 seems to me to be the better option and it shows more hot rodding skills than paying $70K plus for a Zo6, and I like the looks of the C4 better

LD85 said:

Grumpy, lets say I pic up a 454, with iron heads etc. what kind of HP can I expect, if I port the stock heads, new cam and bore it out, no strokeing?

Click to expand...

http://maliburacing.com/patrick_budd_article.htm


this is well written info

then look at
http://maliburacing.com/ (tech)....(Oval Port vs. Rect. Port - BBC cylinder head info. )

now we didn,t always do things the best way in the old days , YET WE DID HAVE FAST BBC MUSCLE CARS , a decent machine shop can add longer valves,back cut the valves, add a 3 angle valve job, do a pocket port job , add beehive springs and clearance the heads for a .650-.700 lift, you then swap to pistons that give a decent cpr in the 10.5-12:1 RANGE ,(THE RADICAL CAMS REQUIRE MORE COMPRESSION) IF YOU NEED TOO, if the heads you have are open chamber designs ,TO GET THAT cpr, ADD A NITROUS KIT UNDER THE CARB,AND and add a good solid flat tappet cam, some 4.11-4.56 rear gears and a 3500 stall converter or a manual trans, A DECENT INTAKE LIKE THE rpm AIR GAP WITH A 780-850 CFM CARB, DECENT HEADERS, and you get an old school muscle car that kicks butt!

YEAH! WE NEEDED HIGH TEST SO YOULL NEED OCTANE BOOSTERS LIKE TOLUENE OR RACE GAS


http://survivalmotorsports.com/ChevroletBBCams2.html

hot STREET
Chevrolet Performance Camshaft; Part Number SS4242
STREET/STRIP
Chevrolet Performance Camshaft; Part Number SS4254
STRIP ONLY
Chevrolet Performance Camshaft; Part Number SS4265

BUT WE EXCEEDED 500 HP VERY EASILY WITH A 427-468 bbc, and with the right parts 600hp plus is do-able

TODAY I WOULD BE HESITANT TO WASTE TIME ON STOCK IRON OVAL PORT HEADS, THERES SO MANY DECENT ALUMINUM HEADS AVAILABLE


http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=TFS-41300001&N=700+115&autoview=sku


Airflow Chart for PowerOval Street Cylinder Heads
Lift Value Intake Flow CFM Exhaust Flow CFM
0.100" 74 64
0.200" 160 113
0.300" 231 146
0.400" 275 178
0.500" 316 209
0.600" 336 240
0.700" 347 264
Tests conducted at 28" of water (pressure). Intake with CNC-bowl blend and
CNC-inlet with Fel-Pro 1212 gasket; exhaust with 2" pipe.



BTW ,when I post answers its to a broad audiance, where I need to cover most applications, you can get that 500-600hp/tq from a 468 BBC but it will require some compromises in the driveability if your not useing a super charger,turbo or nitrous,and theres always guys that suggest that you can get 500hp from a SBC and thats true enought! but in any case the extra displacement and bigger valves and ports allow you to better any sbc results in almost any case where your not throwing huge buckets of cash at the project, and even then once you try to exceed about 500hp youll soon see the BBC has advantages and tends to be cheaper to build at some point

examples

http://www.ohiocrank.com/enginespage1.html
FEATURED ENGINE *
550 Urban Assault Engine
Price


The goal was not top horsepower, although 600 is pretty good, but a broad torque curve. This engine had 625 ft. lb. of torque at 2800 RPM and still was above 625 at 4800. Based on the brand new Merlin III block and featuring Merlin iron heads and aluminum intake the new 550 has produced some phenomenal numbers on the dyno. The engine was designed for daily street use and starts great and idles at a smooth 700 RPM. On the dyno, 18 pulls were made to optimize timing, jetting, etc. Different rocker ratios and carb spacers were also tested.

The engine features all premium components including 4340 steel crank, H-beam rods, forged SRP pistons, Sealed Power plasma moly rings, race bearings parts that will take a good shot of nitrous. A complete Comp Cams valve train is used including the latest technology hydraulic roller cam. Top line brands like MSD, Manley, Holley, and Moroso finish the package.

Options:
for aluminum heads add $800
many options available Complete engine carb to pan
$8,995

youll have a hard time building an HONEST 600hp/625 tq in a small block for $9K


This is a special project for the Super class, and serious bracket racer, that needs power and torque, but also has to make rounds all day without motor maintenance. This engine now makes 900 HP at 6400 RPM with 830 lb. ft. of torque at 4800 running 33 degrees of timing. The cam lift is only .748 and the rockers are Jesel shaft mount. No need to check valve springs and lash between rounds. Engines are built with Merlin III blocks, Brodix BB3X, or Dart 345 heads, Merlin X intake, Ohio Crankshaft 4340 forged 4.75" stroke crank, H-beam rods with ARP 2000 bolts, Canton pan, Comp cam, Felpro gaskets, and Melling oil system.

Every component is available off the shelf, the bore size will allow two rebores, and the compression is 14.3:1 which does not require the ultra expensive gas, or could be run on alcohol. The Best part is the price at $10995, less carb, ignition and valve covers, this is a really great deal.

Options:
Holley 1250 Carb $975
MSD Ignition $695
Valve Covers $295
Aluminum Block $2350
E85 Carb $1300

Complete Engine
$10,995

900hp/830tq from any sbc without a turbo is almost unheard of

heres 675 HP for $9K
http://www.dougherbert.com/555streetchevybb-p-25852.html

a great many thanks for all of the new info, looks like i need to do a lot more reading. i got myself a set of hooker headers already they seem to fit o.k. my biggest hang up was the air conitioning, but i may not use it for now. the summer sure went by fast this year, i had some side projects and a little racing on the go while waiting for parts to arrive. here's a pic of me at the track, last two races of the season, and my friend roger in our favourite rental car at the las vegas speed way earlier in the year. just one more trip to cali to take a race school and i'm back to working on the vette. pics on the way soon.

Why didn't you just port your crossfire:tomato:

to be honest, any carb will flow better than that first gen cavalier/truck crossfire injection. my car is also not a significant year so i don't feel bad about modifying it( 84 vs 67) i agree with grumpy on the shock value of a bbc vette. plus it sure weeds out the meatballs who know nothing about the car. my engine is already proven , all i would like is to be able to tear up the streets a little. my bikes are what i ride if i want to get the heart racing and waste 100k+ plus cars.the engine shop modestly said that it should produce at least 425 hp and the same amount of torque. this should be fun without destroying the drive train.

engine and trans are finally in the car

after a really busy october i finally got a chance to button up the engine and tranny and slip them into my car. the water pump pulley finally arrived after a two month wait. firewall mods helped a lot as clearance is at a premium. i also managed to sell my old engine and exhaust system to someone building a street rod. no turning back now. headers are a tight fit and i'll have them coated after i make sure they clear everything under the hood.pics to follow soon.

Just don't go half way, I don't want another corvette parked in the back yard with grass growing up around it.

84 crossfire:thumbs:

winter is really cold and busy around here, so the vette has been sitting for some time. i did manage to finally modify and install the hooker headers in the car, what a pain that was, now i'm working on the electrical. the starter has to be connected prior to installing the headers otherwise there is no room. i also have to cut a hole in the hood for the induction to clear, there is no other way, so i'm holding off on that part, and working on the pulleys and belt. i'll get some pics soon and post them. in the process i also went and looked at another corvette, same year and identical to mine, but virgin and in nice shape. if the price is right, i was thinking of buying it.

headers

this is how i adjusted the header to fit closer to the block. a quick pull with a chain hoist and then you measure to make sure not to go too far. i had both headers powder coated. also here is what things look like today, not very nice outside.

o.k. back to working on the car finally, got the serpentine belt and accessories figured out , here is what it should look like. still have to add a tensioner pulley next to the alternator but its pretty much what it will look like.

the completed belt set up looks like this, now i have to make up some new hoses for the power steering and then all the brackets have to come off , get bead blasted and painted and re installed.

What are you using for the power steering pump mounting?

I was wondering how this project is going. A worthy endevour...... Keep us posted

the power steering mount is a flat bracket that i bolted onto the bbc in the stock location, right below the alternator. i used a late model fwd pump because of it's small size. still no oil reservoir installed. the project is going slowly, lots to do at work and in life, i'm also working on an awd eagle talon right now, rebuilding the turbo, had a machine shop make me new turbo bushings from scratch.