Rack and pinion steering

I bit the bullet and ordered the rack from Rockauto. It's $120 shipped vs $65 for the junkyard rack, and I had to remove it myself.... not worth the effort....
I verified it's 2.5 turns lock to lock. Now I need the mounting brackets (clamps) and the tie rods and steering shaft.... :smash:
 
Cool, take lots of pix. Sure would like to see someone do a well designed/documented installation.
 
BBShark said:
Cool, take lots of pix. Sure would like to see someone do a well designed/documented installation.
Click to expand...

OH shit, Karsten.....I never thought of you doing the rack conversion, you could have looked over my install for the concept....maybe next time....

:hi:
 
I don't have a clue why I didn't think about looking at the rack and the brackets.... I should have taken photos and some dimensions .... :crap:
 
MYBAD79 said:
I don't have a clue why I didn't think about looking at the rack and the brackets.... I should have taken photos and some dimensions .... :crap:
Click to expand...

Let's see, you in Orlando, right??

we could meet in St. Augustine?? just by the outlet malls?? nice leisurely drive for me, via the back roads....lunch and shopping with the wife too....

not that I"d give her any of MY money.....:lol::devil:
 
Maybe I should drive the '79 up there one weekend.... I am definitely thinking about it, now that it's getting cooler it's actually a pleasure to drive the '79 with the tops off....
 
MYBAD79 said:
Maybe I should drive the '79 up there one weekend.... I am definitely thinking about it, now that it's getting cooler it's actually a pleasure to drive the '79 with the tops off....
Click to expand...

Or like I said meet at someplace convenient like St. Augustine outlet malls, have lunch and let the wives spend their money???

awrite, I chip in a few thou....

call it a shopping excursion....

:harhar:
 
Hi there

Planning on doing the same on my 68 with manual steering gear.
I asume that these Grand Am R&P is power assisted?

How do you mount them at the Vette. Do you have a drawing for a bracket?
Does the Grand Am tie rods fit the Vette?

Are you using universal U-joints to fit the steering rack, and how many?

I know its a lot of questions, but it would be great if all informations could be gathered of how to convert to R&P on a budget cost, compared to a package solution like Steeroids.

Thanks
Lars
 
Yes, the GrandAm rack is power assisted. There is a manual rack available as well, some GrandAms and cavalliers had manual steering.

I have not worked on this project yet, haven't even started.... the weather is really nice right now and I want to keep the '79 driveable for a little bit longer.
When I start fabricating the brackets I'll document every step and all dimensions.

Gene (MrVette) has done this conversion years ago with his own brackets - it sure can be done for less than $300 ($120 for the rack, $60 material for the brackets, maybe another $80 for steering shaft and U-joint from the junkyard)... you do need a welder for the brackets unless you want them to be as flimsy as the junk that they sell with these conversion kits....
 
Karsten is correct, above, the point is...the rack can't really be much higher than that current cross link main shaft but maybe the centerline can be close...

the fore/aft location can't be much different either as the oil pan or the tie rods hitting the lower A arms becomes a problem....SO that leaves the specifics of the lateral placement....in fact MY install is set with the rack one inch to the driver's side....laterally....problem is that I now have unequal length tie rods...so what, never noticed it....not once....my reasoniing was to clear headers I had...no go, in fact I could move the rack to be centered, but then I would have to mod the tie rods again...enough already....


to use just TWO universals from the column to the rack input, I tipped the rack input upward, that necessitated cutting a nice crescent out of the lower rear engine mount so the input universal and bolt would clear....been that way some 6+ years now....all those claims on other sites about Steeroids/VBP claiming MY install would not fit ANY C2-3 are just BOGUS....they flat dunno what in hell they talking about....trying to say it takes 3 joints to make it a universal fit.....:bonkers::mad::flash:

I did my set up with hardware store metal, a welder buddy who suffered through two buildups with me on this, and some time to do the job....it was a winter time project.....

it's winter yet again...time for another project....

:D
 
Looking forward to hear more about your project.
Agree that it shouldn't be that expensive.
I can fabricate/weld the bracket myself. I read in other forums that the kits do have a problem with their brackets.

I see that you are in Sunny Florida. I envie that. The weather here in Denmark is not my cup of tea at this time of the year.
I used to live in Florida. Weston, close to Ft. Lauderdale to be more specific. Great place!

Lars
 
naasaa said:
Looking forward to hear more about your project.
Agree that it shouldn't be that expensive.
I can fabricate/weld the bracket myself. I read in other forums that the kits do have a problem with their brackets.

I see that you are in Sunny Florida. I envie that. The weather here in Denmark is not my cup of tea at this time of the year.
I used to live in Florida. Weston, close to Ft. Lauderdale to be more specific. Great place!

Lars
Click to expand...

Welcome to the good ship Flying Dutchman, piloted by Capt. TT,

the motley crew needs help....

:nuts:
 
I have a Steeroids setup on the 65. The steering is a little too quick for my taste and too much assist. The rack supplied has 2.5 turns L to L so I assume it is a sport rack. Do you think a standard rack would slow down the steering enough to be noticeable? Would it also reduce turning effort a noticeable amount?

What I am looking for is less power assist and slower steering response.

Thanks
Tom
 
Sky65 said:
I have a Steeroids setup on the 65. The steering is a little too quick for my taste and too much assist. The rack supplied has 2.5 turns L to L so I assume it is a sport rack. Do you think a standard rack would slow down the steering enough to be noticeable? Would it also reduce turning effort a noticeable amount?

What I am looking for is less power assist and slower steering response.

Thanks
Tom
Click to expand...

I would have to say my rack is 2.7 turns lock to lock but I can't see that just a 10% change in steering ratio is going to make any significant handling difference.....

thing is, it also depends on the tires/rims, they being the most important thing about any car's abilities....if you are running stock rims, well yes, but the whole car is outta control at that point, if you running more modern rubber/rims....I went with '92 vette rims some 15 years ago....they are 17x9.5 on all 4 corners....255/50/17 up front....275/50/17 in back....
then there are the sway bars, shocks, springs.....

I have a thin bar up front, stock bar in back, 460F springs, 360R plastic spring.....Bilstein shocks...

so many changes can be done in infinite combos with these C2-3 then we get various subjective opinions.....someone maybe well drive my car and think it's a POS.... but I think it's infinitely better than any stock shark...:cool:
 
Sky65 said:
I have a Steeroids setup on the 65. The steering is a little too quick for my taste and too much assist. The rack supplied has 2.5 turns L to L so I assume it is a sport rack. Do you think a standard rack would slow down the steering enough to be noticeable? Would it also reduce turning effort a noticeable amount?

What I am looking for is less power assist and slower steering response.

Thanks
Tom
Click to expand...

The standard rack is 2.75 turns lock to lock. It might be a signifficant and noticeable difference, at $90 without core charge it may be well worth trying the standard rack.

Alignment makes a huge difference too: I remember when they aligned my '79 the guy told me they set the caster to minimum so the steering response would be better... yup, it's a little twitchy IMO.... after this R&P conversion I'll have a close look at the alignment data....
 
MYBAD79 said:
Sky65 said:
I have a Steeroids setup on the 65. The steering is a little too quick for my taste and too much assist. The rack supplied has 2.5 turns L to L so I assume it is a sport rack. Do you think a standard rack would slow down the steering enough to be noticeable? Would it also reduce turning effort a noticeable amount?

What I am looking for is less power assist and slower steering response.

Thanks
Tom
Click to expand...

The standard rack is 2.75 turns lock to lock. It might be a signifficant and noticeable difference, at $90 without core charge it may be well worth trying the standard rack.

Alignment makes a huge difference too: I remember when they aligned my '79 the guy told me they set the caster to minimum so the steering response would be better... yup, it's a little twitchy IMO.... after this R&P conversion I'll have a close look at the alignment data....
Click to expand...
Thanks
I have offset upper control arms and I'm running 4* pos caster. I might give the standard rack a try.
 
mrvette said:
Sky65 said:
I have a Steeroids setup on the 65. The steering is a little too quick for my taste and too much assist. The rack supplied has 2.5 turns L to L so I assume it is a sport rack. Do you think a standard rack would slow down the steering enough to be noticeable? Would it also reduce turning effort a noticeable amount?

What I am looking for is less power assist and slower steering response.

Thanks
Tom
Click to expand...

I would have to say my rack is 2.7 turns lock to lock but I can't see that just a 10% change in steering ratio is going to make any significant handling difference.....

thing is, it also depends on the tires/rims, they being the most important thing about any car's abilities....if you are running stock rims, well yes, but the whole car is outta control at that point, if you running more modern rubber/rims....I went with '92 vette rims some 15 years ago....they are 17x9.5 on all 4 corners....255/50/17 up front....275/50/17 in back....
then there are the sway bars, shocks, springs.....

I have a thin bar up front, stock bar in back, 460F springs, 360R plastic spring.....Bilstein shocks...

so many changes can be done in infinite combos with these C2-3 then we get various subjective opinions.....someone maybe well drive my car and think it's a POS.... but I think it's infinitely better than any stock shark...:cool:
Click to expand...
Thanks
Missed your post. I have screwed with the suspension. Currently using 255/60 on 15" ralleys. I also have shortened 460 front springs, 1.125 ft sway bar, 300 rear spring disconnected the rear bar to reduce over-steer, Spax adjustable shocks, yada yada yada. I may have too many things going on to pin it on any one thing.
 
Sky, Do you have the control rods mounted in the outer hole on the steering arms or the inner hole?

Does the steering steering return to center at speed normally or does it feel over assisted?
 
BBShark said:
Sky, Do you have the control rods mounted in the outer hole on the steering arms or the inner hole?

Does the steering steering return to center at speed normally or does it feel over assisted?
Click to expand...
I am using the inner, PS, holes. Those are the ones specified in the instructions. Is that what everyone else is using? The tie rods also line up better there than the outer, MS, holes.

I think the steering returns to center normally. In general the system more assist than I would like. I already shimmed the flow control valve in the pump to reduce the operating pressure. I think it helped but it could still use less assist.
 
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