GM to cancel the volt.....

I think we'll eventually have to convert our Vettes to something greener to be able to still use it (for regulation reasons or over gas price concern).
I'm doubtfull we'll ever go very far in the battery technology, from what I've read there is a limit in term of amount of energy you can pack in a certain volume:weight.
The hydrogen solution look much more coherent, especially with scientists coming up with direct sunlight-to-hydrogen solution, cutting the inefficient electricy middleman.

I doubt that, gasoline will be with us for along time. Unless you drive it daily there would be no point. Now if the government forces us to stop using gas in a low use older vehicle, we have much worse things to worry about.
Sure, it all depends on how long is a long time.

Canada has the second largest oil reserves behind Saudi...and that's not counting oil shale...US oil shale reserves are estimated at 1.5 trillion barels...5x the amount of reserves of Saudi.

1.5 trillion would cover the US for 250 years..

Gas will be around for the rest of our lifetimes.
 
The Model T Ford revolutionised the way the world does business and life. A practical electric vehicle will do the same. It's just a matter of time.

Pollution will decline.
Noise pollution will decline.
Oil changes a thing of the past.
Oil deposits on roads and freeways will stop.
Storm water runoff/oceanic pollution will decrease.
Photovoltaic usage will increase.
Point of use will decrease transmission line construction.

This will happen. I just do not know when.

A mere 20 years ago, this forum could not exist.
 
Even when a practical replacement for gasoline powered autos arrives, gasoline will still be widely available unless banned. The price would even go down b/c of less demand. A practical replacement will have to be cheaper and successful without subsidy.
 
Even when a practical replacement for gasoline powered autos arrives, gasoline will still be widely available unless banned. The price would even go down b/c of less demand. A practical replacement will have to be cheaper and successful without subsidy.
I vote for hydrogen as fuel and thorium nuclear reactor as energy source.

The guy from the article, talking about the future of energy consumption and production.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTtmU2lD97o[/ame]
 
I would say the way governments are handling this, soon we will all be living under a three or in a cave again.
It's getting anoying. The problem is the mass seems like brainwashed somehow.

Lately they were talking about reducing the carbon dioxide levels with 30%...They must think we all have our pockets full of money to buy all those environmental gimmicks that are economically totally insane.
 
The Model T Ford revolutionised the way the world does business and life. A practical electric vehicle will do the same. It's just a matter of time.

Pollution will decline.
Noise pollution will decline.
Oil changes a thing of the past.
Oil deposits on roads and freeways will stop.
Storm water runoff/oceanic pollution will decrease.
Photovoltaic usage will increase.
Point of use will decrease transmission line construction.

This will happen. I just do not know when.

A mere 20 years ago, this forum could not exist.

The Model T did it without a single government subsidy. That's because it was the right idea at the right time.
 
The Model T Ford revolutionised the way the world does business and life. A practical electric vehicle will do the same. It's just a matter of time.

Pollution will decline.
Noise pollution will decline.
Oil changes a thing of the past.
Oil deposits on roads and freeways will stop.
Storm water runoff/oceanic pollution will decrease.
Photovoltaic usage will increase.
Point of use will decrease transmission line construction.

This will happen. I just do not know when.

A mere 20 years ago, this forum could not exist.
How do you come to these conclusion? All pie-in-the-sky rose-colored glasses stuff. No one ever thinks about the unintended side effects, partly because we just don't know what they'll be yet.
When we talk about electric vehicles, they'll never come into their own until they have a 1000 mile range on a charge and can be completely recharged over night. How could you make a cross-country trip in a Tesla? Battery weight will have to go down by at least a factor and efficiency will have to go up by several factors. You just can't pour electrons into your car on the side of the road. Not saying it won't happen at some point, but it's not even in the foreseeable future.
As for hydrogen, sounds great and all, but let's talk about those side effects. Out here in the desert, are we really going to pour our precious drinking water into our cars? How stupid is that? On the coast, what would all the desalinization plants look like? Imagine driving in the Pacific NW at rush hour with half a million cars emitting water vapor. You would be swimming home.
Besides, what are we going to do with the oil that is naturally occurring? Just leave it there? Doesn't do the earth any good, right? It's a pollutant in its natural form. We don't eat it, we don't drink it. The only thing it's good for is energy.
 
Out here in the desert, are we really going to pour our precious drinking water into our cars?
Please check the video I posted, you'd learn it takes something little two big bottle of drinking water to power a house for a day. Given you could use toilet water to make hydrogen, if you could pee, you could drive.
 
The Model T Ford revolutionised the way the world does business and life. A practical electric vehicle will do the same. It's just a matter of time.

Pollution will decline.
Noise pollution will decline.
Oil changes a thing of the past.
Oil deposits on roads and freeways will stop.
Storm water runoff/oceanic pollution will decrease.
Photovoltaic usage will increase.
Point of use will decrease transmission line construction.

This will happen. I just do not know when.

A mere 20 years ago, this forum could not exist.
How do you come to these conclusion? All pie-in-the-sky rose-colored glasses stuff. No one ever thinks about the unintended side effects, partly because we just don't know what they'll be yet.
When we talk about electric vehicles, they'll never come into their own until they have a 1000 mile range on a charge and can be completely recharged over night. How could you make a cross-country trip in a Tesla? Battery weight will have to go down by at least a factor and efficiency will have to go up by several factors. You just can't pour electrons into your car on the side of the road. Not saying it won't happen at some point, but it's not even in the foreseeable future.
As for hydrogen, sounds great and all, but let's talk about those side effects. Out here in the desert, are we really going to pour our precious drinking water into our cars? How stupid is that? On the coast, what would all the desalinization plants look like? Imagine driving in the Pacific NW at rush hour with half a million cars emitting water vapor. You would be swimming home.
Besides, what are we going to do with the oil that is naturally occurring? Just leave it there? Doesn't do the earth any good, right? It's a pollutant in its natural form. We don't eat it, we don't drink it. The only thing it's good for is energy.




Correct, I never knew that, but 20 years ago a visit through the Permian Basin on a drive from Ft. Worth to El Paso, confirmed the above, it was amazing the sites and smells of that land the oil and gas naturally seeps outta the ground, kinda like what I hear of Saudi, I imagine.....

as for water in the SW regions, for over 40 years now, it has been most obvious what to do, but for our .gov to ever think ahead is just not happening....so here I go.....

We here in north America need get our act together, and alleviate several national problems at once, build maybe a dozen nuclear power plants that serve a double purpose, to back up the grid in summer/winter when they are not busy doing this job.....

the Job IS.....from many pickup points along the Mississippi river flood plain, was up stream on the Missouri, Ohio, Miss, Ark, Trinity, and any other river that floods, we pump the water outta them and send it trans continental to the SW regions for irrigation and use, even storage use the Grand Canyon if we have to....seriously....so in spring time when they bitch about all the farm fertilizer being washed into the Gulf of Mexico and causing a alge bloom or what ever they bitch about.....all the surplus snow melt water if caught and sent west, no more New Orleans flooding, no more flooding out farms and town along the Miss river banks......SO all that nice fresh water is used where needed, spring time is when the grid is under less demand because of mild temps, so pumping energy is not taking away from the grid.....
I guess about a dozen 16' diameter pipes should do the job pretty well, if more needed, fine....just DO IT, DAMNIT!!! want to create jobs? and actually have a interstate highway type gigantic project? that's IT.....

screw the green weenies....

:crylol::hunter:
 
When we talk about electric vehicles, they'll never come into their own until they have a 1000 mile range on a charge and can be completely recharged over night. How could you make a cross-country trip in a Tesla? Battery weight will have to go down by at least a factor and efficiency will have to go up by several factors. You just can't pour electrons into your car on the side of the road. Not saying it won't happen at some point, but it's not even in the foreseeable future.
.

Most miles driven are commuting. Fine for an electric and with current technology.
 
Ha, the L59 LSx in my Olds is E85 compatible. I've only seen 1 E85 pump in my life.
Besides, if it were not for subsidies E85 would be more expensive than gas and get worse milage.
Propane is already a proven winner with fleet cars/trucks and is widely available in parts of europe.
If you want a viable alternative consider propane/LPG. 110 octane, similar energy content, and you get a few thousand back from the gov.

How about just filling up with E85 adjusting the mixture screws and just keep motoring. Can't find E85. Put standard gas in, turn the mix screws back and keep motoring.

I've already done it. And haven't burst into flames.

Why would i want to put $1000s into a propane conversion?
 
Ha, the L59 LSx in my Olds is E85 compatible. I've only seen 1 E85 pump in my life.
Besides, if it were not for subsidies E85 would be more expensive than gas and get worse milage.
Propane is already a proven winner with fleet cars/trucks and is widely available in parts of europe.


I don't give a shit about subsidies. There are many things that are 100% paid for by the government and are a damn good thing, medical research, space exploration, particle physics, etc, etc, etc.. If not for these things we'd be be way way behind where we are now.

The military is "subsidized". Energy is a national security issue. You'd think right wingers could understand that.

All that pollitical bullshit aside. From a practical standpoint i'm just friggin lazy and E85 works with just 30 seconds of tuning. Most people will shitcan their vette or let it rot before they go through all the trouble and expense to convert to propane or LNG.

Does right wing pollitics have to enter every conversation? Getting thousands back from the GOV with propane/LPG is what.........a subsidy.

Not a lot of logic there.
 
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Ha, the L59 LSx in my Olds is E85 compatible. I've only seen 1 E85 pump in my life.
Besides, if it were not for subsidies E85 would be more expensive than gas and get worse milage.
Propane is already a proven winner with fleet cars/trucks and is widely available in parts of europe.
If you want a viable alternative consider propane/LPG. 110 octane, similar energy content, and you get a few thousand back from the gov.

How about just filling up with E85 adjusting the mixture screws and just keep motoring. Can't find E85. Put standard gas in, turn the mix screws back and keep motoring.

I've already done it. And haven't burst into flames.

Why would i want to put $1000s into a propane conversion?

Over 20 years ago Suburban Propane used to deliver some 100? gallons to my tank behind the garage, for garage heat, had a house furnace in it....Zero to 80f in about 2 minits....talk about a BURNOUT!!!!.....:shocking:, at any rate, he ran his truck off the cargo, had a funky sound to that diesel it knocked but with a different sound than the usual .....:drink:
 
When we talk about electric vehicles, they'll never come into their own until they have a 1000 mile range on a charge and can be completely recharged over night. How could you make a cross-country trip in a Tesla? Battery weight will have to go down by at least a factor and efficiency will have to go up by several factors. You just can't pour electrons into your car on the side of the road. Not saying it won't happen at some point, but it's not even in the foreseeable future.
.

Most miles driven are commuting. Fine for an electric and with current technology.

Trick is, if it is a commuter car, under what circumstances, last time I was in DC that damn beltway of theirs was a parking lot at 2pm, fuggetboutit during rush hours so what with winter heaters/blowers and headlights, it makes me wonder if a 30 MPC (miles per charge) Volt would even come close to getting one home under those circumstances....:shocking::tomato:
 
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Ha, the L59 LSx in my Olds is E85 compatible. I've only seen 1 E85 pump in my life.
Besides, if it were not for subsidies E85 would be more expensive than gas and get worse milage.
Propane is already a proven winner with fleet cars/trucks and is widely available in parts of europe.


I don't give a shit about subsidies. There are many things that are 100% paid for by the government and are a damn good thing, medical research, space exploration, particle physics, etc, etc, etc.. If not for these things we'd be be way way behind where we are now.

The military is "subsidized". Energy is a national security issue. You'd think right wingers could understand that.

All that pollitical bullshit aside. From a practical standpoint i'm just friggin lazy and E85 works with just 30 seconds of tuning. Most people will shitcan their vette or let it rot before they go through all the trouble and expense to convert to propane or LNG.

Does right wing pollitics have to enter every conversation? Getting thousands back from the GOV with propane/LPG is what.........a subsidy.

Not a lot of logic there.

RONG!!! My ex, the kids mom worked at the National Library of Medicine, part of National Institutes of Health in Bethesda Md, right across the street from the old Navy Medical Center, now combined with the Walter Reed Army Medical Corps......and so it seems some years ago, then Howard Hughes died, he left all his shit to the Hughes Medical Foundation.....and so a old friend gave up his construction business to be head of building maintenance for the Hughes Med Center, directly across Old Georgetown Rd. from NIH, on the other side of the campus from Navy Med......and so the 3+ billion bux that the med center got was invested and the proceeds used to ....fund medical research, working in close coordination with NIH funding.....SO all that bullshit about stem cell research of years ago?? went on anyway.....

and yes ENERGY IS a national security issue, so how to we put the KABOSH to the green weenies worried over every snail darter and smelly delta fish and left over dinosaur.....??

:search:
 
Huh, what politics????
They're probably using LPG or NG to generate the electricity for your volt or to distil the ETOH in your E85. Why not take the middle man out of it. You know..... kinda like feeding tuna mayonaise to make tuna salad.....
Judging by your response, I gotta wonder if you had a traumatic accident with a gas grill in your past.
Ha, the L59 LSx in my Olds is E85 compatible. I've only seen 1 E85 pump in my life.
Besides, if it were not for subsidies E85 would be more expensive than gas and get worse milage.
Propane is already a proven winner with fleet cars/trucks and is widely available in parts of europe.


I don't give a shit about subsidies. There are many things that are 100% paid for by the government and are a damn good thing, medical research, space exploration, particle physics, etc, etc, etc.. If not for these things we'd be be way way behind where we are now.

The military is "subsidized". Energy is a national security issue. You'd think right wingers could understand that.

All that pollitical bullshit aside. From a practical standpoint i'm just friggin lazy and E85 works with just 30 seconds of tuning. Most people will shitcan their vette or let it rot before they go through all the trouble and expense to convert to propane or LNG.

Does right wing pollitics have to enter every conversation? Getting thousands back from the GOV with propane/LPG is what.........a subsidy.

Not a lot of logic there.
 
[.....SO all that bullshit about stem cell research of years ago?? went on anyway.....:

So i expect if you contract cancer, you will refuse any bullshit stem cell based cure.

This from a guy who quotes Thomas Edison.

I am NOT part of the fictitious right, so I am proudly a part of the PRACTICAL right.....leave philosophy and dreams out of it.....

physics ain't KIND, stone is hard, air is soft, and we need to get used to it....

CASE CLOSED......:rolleyes::clobbered:


sorry, edit....I read it another way, what you said above......it was a comment on the bullshit that somehow public funding was going to kill stem cell research, in practical effect it never happened, because of that coordination between these two equally funded bio-med groups, one with private funding, and there are many others....and the other, public funded....

methinks you can get my drift....
 
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