GM to cancel the volt.....
- Thread starter mrvette
- Start date
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Denpo, Electricity is gonna stay cheap as the greenies attack the sources????????
Face it, the ultimate goal is to drive us back to the stone age where Flintstones beat out the Jetsons, probably under sharia.
:shocking: Ain't THAT the damn truth of the shituation....
prrtt:
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Could be 3.59 IF you .gov didn't use it to fund other bullshit they do.....
I dunno why they just don't do a flat tax like we need to do here....so much simpler say 10% Federal sales tax across the board....
:beer:
Just some ramblings
Would you only wear one color of clothing, or the same color as everyone else?
Drive the same car?
Eat the same meal?
and on and on and on . . .
Why is it that for whatever problem, there can only be a single solution, or only one choice?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Most solutions won't scale up. We need to get more efficient with resource usage, so we don't spend so much time, effort, and money (and resources) moving them around.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Look around. How many of the things you take for granted would be there if 20, 15, or even 10 years ago, people just accepted what existed at that time as the epitome of achievement?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
We need to find some balance between the status quo, which isn't really sustainable in the long term, and the sometime disruptive effects that go along with progress.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
These are the thoughts I've had whenever this type of discussion comes up. Maybe one day I'll get around to fleshing them out a bit more and finding some good examples.
Mike
Would you only wear one color of clothing, or the same color as everyone else?
Drive the same car?
Eat the same meal?
and on and on and on . . .
Why is it that for whatever problem, there can only be a single solution, or only one choice?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Most solutions won't scale up. We need to get more efficient with resource usage, so we don't spend so much time, effort, and money (and resources) moving them around.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Look around. How many of the things you take for granted would be there if 20, 15, or even 10 years ago, people just accepted what existed at that time as the epitome of achievement?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
We need to find some balance between the status quo, which isn't really sustainable in the long term, and the sometime disruptive effects that go along with progress.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
These are the thoughts I've had whenever this type of discussion comes up. Maybe one day I'll get around to fleshing them out a bit more and finding some good examples.
Mike
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
The only MAJOR change to lifestyle over the last 40 years has been due to electronics, engine mgmt, computers, sensors, communications......and other than better mgmt due to electronic capabilities, little else has changed...damn little, locomotives still have wheels, and tracks and loads to pull, cars still have rubber tires, and planes still have jet engines and wings....
it is what it is.......Fizz icks is a bitch....
and the status quo IS sustainable with relative ease for the next several hundred years, anyway....barring some planetary disaster, like the Japan Quake, Ca. falling into the ocean, etc.....:clobbered:
You need a rebuild at 100K miles. Do you live your life 1/4 mile at a time?
Even my crappy GM motors run over 250K miles. Btw, what's the lifespan of electic motors and batteries???????????
Even my crappy GM motors run over 250K miles. Btw, what's the lifespan of electic motors and batteries???????????
68/70Vette
Well-known member
The Volt's battery contains about as much energy as 1 1/2 gallons of gasoline. 1 1/2 gallons of gasoline weighs about 10 pounds. The Volts battery weighs 410 pounds. Replacing a 10 pound energy source with an equivalent that weighs 410 pounds does not make sense from an engineering standpoint. In fact, it doesn't seem intelligent.
I won't swoon with surprise if someone presented a careful detailed end to end analysis that showed battery powered cars were more environmentally unfriendly than a gasoline powered car. Certainly if the utility power to charge the Volts battery comes from a hydrocarbon burning power plant, the Volt has no environmental advantage. IMO.
I won't swoon with surprise if someone presented a careful detailed end to end analysis that showed battery powered cars were more environmentally unfriendly than a gasoline powered car. Certainly if the utility power to charge the Volts battery comes from a hydrocarbon burning power plant, the Volt has no environmental advantage. IMO.
turtlevette
The Turdle
You believe in freedom right? Do you want to prevent people from driving electric vehicles and using ethanol as fuel? It's easy to be against anything new. If you were around at the turn of the last century you'd be against the new fangled horseless carriage? Oh wait. You and Gene were around.
Last edited:
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Uh, no, but my Father was born in 1905 and so broke/sprained his wrist on a T Ford, crank start.....then switch to Chebby because of the then brand new Kettering STARTER motor.....never owned a Ford since....Dad was '79 at passing....
I say let the public decide if it's worth it, but batteries need more bounce to the ounce, let's say, politely.....
:hissyfit:
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
I bet the power train weighs less than a traditional internal combustion engine. Add electric motor. Delete engine and tranny, and the 400 lbs is a wash.
No doubt a lighter/more efficient battery is the key though. And it just needs to store energy convertable to electricity. It need not be a traditional battery per se.
Add charging the battery from your home solar array, and the energy used directly from power plants is greatly reduced.
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Do any of you realize the voltage in a electric car is lethal?? it's like 700 volts, that is a serious charge, and with any battery supplying that amount of voltage, the amount of cells in series is krazy, and the current available makes for interesting power management....Must be a interesting battery charger...I tempted to roll down the road and look at a Volt just for the knowing.... roll up the road to see this Prius too....:nuts:
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
As a member of IBEW 32 years, I do not require much explaining about motors and drives.
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
Diesel-electric locomotives have ruled the rails since WWII. They are now quite efficient, polluting less and less, and can transport 1 ton 100 miles on a gallon of fuel.
If the GE engineers partnered with GM, no telling what they could come up with for trucks, let alone cars.
Like steam power, electric motors have 100% torque at 1 rpm.
Creating a whole new industry, along with a whole new service industry would create 1,000's of new jobs.:thumbs:
OR, we could wait on our laurels and let another country take the lead.ush:
If the GE engineers partnered with GM, no telling what they could come up with for trucks, let alone cars.
Like steam power, electric motors have 100% torque at 1 rpm.
Creating a whole new industry, along with a whole new service industry would create 1,000's of new jobs.:thumbs:
OR, we could wait on our laurels and let another country take the lead.
ush:clutchdust
Millionaire Playboy
I have no problem with other countries taking the lead in dead-end technology. Not saying this is dead end technology, but I am saying it's still not ready for prime time. I still go back to the part about range and recharge rate. It may make sense for a small run-about for day-to-day commuting. But unless you can figure out a way to recharge it in 30 minutes or less it just won't happen.
But don't get me wrong, I think if they can work out a way to make diesel-electric work on long haul trucking, I would be all for it. But pure electric isn't working for any long distance travel in the foreseeable future.
But don't get me wrong, I think if they can work out a way to make diesel-electric work on long haul trucking, I would be all for it. But pure electric isn't working for any long distance travel in the foreseeable future.
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
You do know the Volt has an onboard gasoline generator, giving it virtually no range limit? It gets 40 MPG in that mode.
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Diesel-electric locomotives have ruled the rails since WWII. They are now quite efficient, polluting less and less, and can transport 1 ton 100 miles on a gallon of fuel.
If the GE engineers partnered with GM, no telling what they could come up with for trucks, let alone cars.
Like steam power, electric motors have 100% torque at 1 rpm.
Creating a whole new industry, along with a whole new service industry would create 1,000's of new jobs.:thumbs:
OR, we could wait on our laurels and let another country take the lead.
RR's have almost no rolling resistance either, steel to steel, on roller/ball bearings which is why the GG1 Locomotives of the Pa. RR were so successful....GE Baldwin...20 hz trackside generation plants, most of the locos ran 3 MILLION miles between overhauls.....Google the GG1 loco for an interesting story about the Wash Dc Union station, and a certain GG1 passenger train wreck along about '53 or so.....:hissyfit:
clutchdust
Millionaire Playboy
Yes. I know exactly that. Like I said, pure electric won't work in the foreseeable future. "Electric" cars will only work with the engine/generator set up. I have no problem with that, for someone else. Not for me though.
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
I wonder if we reduced the size/weight of the battery in one of them cars, we could get better than 40 mpg?? why not??
:smash::smash::twitch::flash::shocking:
turtlevette
The Turdle
Well of course. Most miles driven each day are people going to work, not touring the country. It's not for me but its perfect for many many people.
How do you think we take a technology to "prime time". You spend a bunch of money designing and redesigning and testing.
I see a lot of people who hate the President thinking they need to hate every damn thing he's for. Try to see through that, be open minded and evaluate technology leaving politics out. I'd love to run E85 but there's so much negative stupid old wives tales about it that nobody wants to put it in their cars. Hell people in Florida think 10% ethanol blends are going to "hurt" their cars and boats and are all bent out of shape. The rest of the country has been using it for 30 years.
How can we make any progress when we have so many people constantly throwing up road blocks? I'm starting to understand why Europeans think we're knuckle draggers.