Plastic Fantastic 2

[SuperBuickGuy]

more incremental progress
this

is now this



more trimming in the wheel well



and now make it hold itself up


the back bolt lines up with the front edge of the bracket I made


and is 9 9/16 from the bottom of the bolt head holding the cradle in place to the center of the rear-most bolt
front, I can't remember off the top of my head but it's roughly 9 and change above the bolt head of the front bracket.... in real numbers 1 1/2 above the 2x4 I built in the front, 1" below the top of the frame on the rear... (ish).
overall width from flat of the bracket to flat is 39 3/8

front... the upper arm needs to move back about 1" in this picture

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[SuperBuickGuy]

I'm hoping at SEMA I can find a wheel sponsor

back to frame mods



eyeballing





kind of sort of where it goes

I know I drive some nuts with how I do this.... here, let me be first to melt your snowflake, I don't care if you like my way or not

first is notch the frame - that white line needs to line up with the rear-most bolt on the a-arm


clean



weld nuts inside

weld to piece



I think the front is too low thus the notching you see next


lots of cutting that original notch later




other side - this is pretty close to where it needs to live.... note the angles and diverging bits.edited I think GM thought through all the points of a corner (and I'm going to check this) so that when the car goes right, the tire moves towards the rear tire (basically using the dirt-track method to help the car go left)... thus these aren't parallel with each other, but rather it does several things to help turn


​​​​​​​anyway, the answer to that question won't happen until next week....edited

 

[bobs77vet]

wow that's nice

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

back from SEMA, back to work



and this is wrong.... this is also why I mock then walk away


still wrong


this is correct... note how the upper arm moved up about 2"?




so some dimensions for a coil over manufacturer






I'm bracing myself for the costs of the coilovers then the wheels then the tires..... cheap or fast....edited

 

[rtj]

I like the “snowflake” comment. If it was an original 63 split window or L88 car, maybe. But that is the beauty of a C3 late model car, prices are low and there are lots for sale in various states of disrepair.

I saw a picture the other day of a c3 race car with a front transverse spring. Probably cheaper than coil overs if you use c5 parts.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

I like the “snowflake” comment. If it was an original 63 split window or L88 car, maybe. But that is the beauty of a C3 late model car, prices are low and there are lots for sale in various states of disrepair.

I saw a picture the other day of a c3 race car with a front transverse spring. Probably cheaper than coil overs if you use c5 parts.

I like rubber bumper C3s because I rarely get a chalk-sniffer complaining what I did to the car.

I really seriously considered Bob's spring offer - but came to the conclusion that I am not certain enough about ride height to commit to it. There is no adjustment (lowering) for the transverse spring. I met the Senior Product Developer for Aldan Coilovers at SEMA. We talked and now I've ordered a set of coilovers (off the shelf, thankfully) for my car. Since it's Summit where I got it from, expect that picture next Monday....

 

[Red77]

I've been traveling for work, so it's nice to catch up. Looks like you're making some great progress.

 

[rtj]

Looks like c5’s can use lowering bolts, but probably not as easy to change/adjust as coil-overs. Waiting to hear driving impressions.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

a large part of me (and one that is currently winning) has me driving this in this form this summer then blow it apart next winter for paint, frame welding, and stuff like that

Under the headline, I'll take lucky over good every time.edited Yes, the Camaro unitized bearings bolt directly into the Corvette spindle




what doesn't bolt is the caliper

only about 1/2" off...


trimming is required

a good hack but not enough

that's better



however there's another issue that I don't know if I'm going to (or even can) fix


notice the perpendicular to the ground?
not so much up here


before I get too jiggy with the brakes, though, time to finalize the front suspension by yet another round of balls and measures


A key point here.... at the moment (other then perpendicular upper control arm issue, I'm well within factory tolerance of 1/8".... 1/32 - the key point is this, don't spend your life trying to make this perfect, there are no perfect roads therefore there is no perfect suspension.

 

[69427]

a large part of me (and one that is currently winning) has me driving this in this form this summer then blow it apart next winter for paint, frame welding, and stuff like that

..........................................
the key point is this, don't spend your life trying to make this perfect, there are no perfect roads therefore there is no perfect suspension.

I agree with your philosophy.

1) I used to paint and polish new stuff when I modified my car. But I quickly found that after some test miles or track days that I was too often just having to grind off the paint to cut and modify/weld the parts to change geometry issues or assembly/serviceability difficulties. Now I just focus on the functionality of the part, and worry about aesthetics later.

2) I also share your thoughts on the lack of perfect roads/tracks.


A question about the Camaro wheel bearing assembly you mentioned earlier. Are there different specifications for those versus the Corvette parts?

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

difference between Camaro and Corvette spec. The Camaro have a larger flange and larger studs along with no ABS sensor in the hub. Otherwise, they're identical in depth and rear bolt pattern.

more work done
time to set the uppers


and a slight issue, the upper arms are too far inboard (1/2" per side)
no big deal... in other news, Z06 wheels







no optical illusion.... fronts need about 1" more offset, rear need another 1 1/2" width.edited
In other news the rotors don't really clear 19s


with that said, all I have to do is remove the vibration dampers - put there so people don't whine about rattly brakes (and you won't hear over the 427)... I dunno, I hate to say I may need wider front flares but I may need wider front flares....edited

 

[vette427sbc]

Moving along nicely! I like those wheels too... I assume youre using the stock C5 track width? Wider=cooler

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

Moving along nicely! I like those wheels too... I assume youre using the stock C5 track width? Wider=cooler

I like the wheels, but .... I'm not sure I want to re-flare ..... although, adding another inch to the front width .... yeah, conflicted.
Those wheels a seller brought by my house to see if they fit - the biggest issue right now (still thinking this through) is the rears aren't wide enough.

yep, stock C5 track width. I honestly cannot wait to see whether my thought - that combining the C5/6 front suspension with the 2010-2016 Camaro rear would be a marriage made in heaven or like my first wife - looked great in pictures but wasn't stable.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

dagnabit.... but first, success

my coilovers


they're less expensive then the QA1s, and are a better product.... good to know, right? and yes, made in USA

they'll go somewhere around there


this tool.... I love it but


all this work you see, I get to do it again



so here's the deal - I have the shop drawings for the C5 Corvette.edited I've been using them and following them faithfully.edited Tonight I started on the move the upper arms out project and thought "that doesn't look right" then "don't argue with your tape measure".... turns out I should have argued with my memory.

GM gives you the dimensions to the bolt head.edited The first clue was my Joes alignment level - suddenly the top of the tire was pointing out, I'm setting it up as neutral.edited Then I had to adjust the toe wayyyyyy out.edited Whisky Tango Foxtrot, I queried.editededited

the dimension GM gives across the car from bolt to center to bolt is 19 11/16.edited That equals 39 3/8 from bolt head to bolt head.... so where did I screw up?edited I was measuring from flat to flat...edited that is almost exactly 1" from the bolt head..... so it's out 2".... I should have remembered that because in my research I had to find out the dimension of a bolt head (they're 1/2" tall) and weirdly, it doesn't matter the size of the suspension bolt - they're all 1/2" tall (top to flange)

So later this week I'll make it 2" narrower then reset the toe where it belongs.... ugh.edited All is normal with the world because I'm usually the warning

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

here we go again


chop chop


now floppy again


lining up the marks


tack back together


dead on



I've set the alignment cams to zero degrees.edited I still need to double check the altitude of the front and rear of the upper arm, but once that's done I'll burn it in for real (again again) then start making it look I know what I'm doing

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

evaporust says 12 hours, 70 degrees.... we will see - this corvette jack was submerged in the back of my Corvette when I got it.editededited

it's submerged with my lathe center - I figure that's a fair test....


onward... yeah, looks the same


I learned a long time ago, you cannot have too many plumb bobs


and now...edited




looks the same except now it's where it's going to liveedited



hopefully Sunday I'll get this all in place


and make the mounts for this

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[rtj]

I admire your ambition. The easiest way (and cheapest) to increase the front flares for you might be to split at the bonding strip and lay in a 1” strip of suitable material. If you wanted you could have a open gap at the door.

No, I haven’t tried it, but that’s the plan for my bolt on l88 flares (1” strip under edge). Then foam and fiberglass.

 

[mfain]

Here's a time and labor intensive solution for fender flares. I completely revised the suspension on my old NASA-spec Ford Focus and ended up with a 4 inch wider track width. I built "poster board" flares, covered them with fiberglass, sanded them smooth, pulled molds off the "bucks", and then pulled flares from the molds.

Pappy

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

I admire your ambition. The easiest way (and cheapest) to increase the front flares for you might be to split at the bonding strip and lay in a 1” strip of suitable material. If you wanted you could have a open gap at the door.

No, I haven’t tried it, but that’s the plan for my bolt on l88 flares (1” strip under edge). Then foam and fiberglass.

I'm leaning more and more towards just getting wheels that fit. While it would be nice to have an off-the-shelf solution for when these wheels go out of style and are irreplaceable; I knew I was going to need at least 2 custom wheels anyway (for the front). That said, because of where the hub is, I may end up doing a lot more flare work anyway.

as for moving them out. 1/4" plastic - glue strips then shape.... that said, it is really hard to extend a curve because you usually end up with a flat spot in the transition that looks odd.

 

[bobs77vet]

seems like custom wheels are appropriate for this build!